Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:00 Hello and welcome. I'm here to provide acknowledgement of country. For those who don't know me, I'm kj Karen Jackson, director of Moon Balletic. My genealogy tracks back to Moira Lakes in Barma Forest and Mount Hope in Pyramid Hill. Giving me my connections to Yorta, Yorta, and Barra language groups. There's a couple of things I'd like you to take away from my acknowledgement. The first is to remember the hidden history of Aboriginal people since invasion, our loss of language removal from country, and our new extinction from massacres and pandemics. The second is our strong and inherent connection to community and country. These connections have given us the resilience and courage to rebuild our languages, gain access to country, regenerate our cultural practices in acknowledging the traditional owners of the country on which you are now on. I'd like to sincerely thank them for their generosity and kindness in welcoming people onto their lands. Lands never seeded and lands that run deep into their being and spirit. I wish to pay my deep respect to the ancestors, elders, communities, and families of the rung wri on whose land I stand and who create connection and share knowledge with all of us. Thank you.
Speaker 2 00:01:18 Hello, colleagues, and welcome to the People of VU podcast. I want to thank very deeply Karen Jackson, kj for her very important acknowledgement of country at the which we have at the beginning of every episode. And I two want to join her in acknowledging our deep respects for ancestors, elders, and families of the traditional owners on all of our campuses, both here in Melbourne and in Sydney and in Brisbane. Now today on people of view who are honored to welcome Peter Laver, am former Chancellor of Victoria University, a distinguishing distinguished engineer, a lifelong advocate for skills, for education, for equity and innovation. We're gonna talk to him about all those topics. But Peter, it's so kind of you to come and speak. And here we are back again, not in a council meeting. Isn't that a relief? That's good.
Speaker 3 00:02:08 The pleasure's all mine. Ed, this
Speaker 2 00:02:10 Is great. So Peter, I'm gonna go back in time a bit because we'd love to know a bit more about what makes you tick and as you were growing up. So you were born in Melbourne, 1940, attended Carey Baptist. Tell us, you know, you must have thought about this a bit and been back to that school sometimes. Haven't you had a look?
Speaker 3 00:02:25 Yes, I've been, because I lived interstate for a fair while. I didn't have any connection with them for a while, but after I came back, I reconnected. They look after their old boys, pretty old girls as well these days. Pretty well. They have a lunch once a year where you can invent stories about what used to happen at school each year. The lives get bigger, but it's, yes, it, I think I got a good education there. It certainly gave me, because of the science teachers involved, it certainly gave me a lifelong interest in science and technology.
Speaker 2 00:03:07 So is that where science began for you?
Speaker 3 00:03:09 Yes, I was. I did well in chemistry and physics, and I guess one of the reasons that I ended up deciding to do metallurgical engineering is that it embraced both the chemical side and the physical side. So they honored me by, when I got my metallurgical engineering degree by closing down the school of metallurgy. But they acknowledged that in fact, metallurgy is a, is is actually two subjects. There's a physical metallurgy and, and properties of material. Yep. And there's extractive metallurgy of taking alls and making metal out of 'em. One ended up in mechanical engineering and one ended up in, in, in chemical engineering. I took the extractive side, and that was my early career really was working in iron making and steel making.
Speaker 2 00:03:59 Well, let's talk about it in extractive industries. They're huge in Australia, like the tradition, it goes back a long time, but it's been, you know, almost like world famous really for the quality, the innovation, the technology. So when you began, so you finish your degree, your bachelor Yep. 1962. How did you get into the workforce? Like what was the first break in for you?
Speaker 3 00:04:20 It was a pure accident four years before then when the careers presentation at, at school, they had these pamphlets on scholarships, and one was from BHP and I picked up this pamphlet and took it home. And it turns out in those days you had a Commonwealth scholarship that paid for your tuition, but you had to live somehow or other. I showed it to my father. He said, you better go and get one of these scholarships because, and I don't have to have to support you at home. So I, I did that, went to Port Kemler at the age of 18 on the train, eventually convinced them that I was worthy enough and actually went on the BHP payroll from the age of 18 while I was full-time university.
Speaker 2 00:05:11 So they were really effectively sponsoring it as
Speaker 3 00:05:13 Well. That's right. And they, they paid you and they provided a, a every vacation you could go work at the steelworks. They were very good that way. And so by the time I graduated, I'd had a fair bit of experience in the industry. I knew what I was working into. The downside of that is that I started off as a, a medalist for, worked for two or three years, but then went on a thing they called a special cadetship, which sent you around the country to all then BHPs operations, which were a lot smaller than they are now, and ended up in Melbourne office. So I stopped being an engineering as such probably two, two years after I graduated. And I've sort of winged it since then. Yeah,
Speaker 2 00:06:01 Well, it's winging it is sometimes really good. But what brought you to places like Port Headland, for example?
Speaker 3 00:06:07 Well, I had a career, that management job in the first one was in Ana, south of Perth, running the steel plant there at the age of 29. And the, the youngest person reporting to me at that stage was 42. So I was seen as a, a bit of an upstart. Then came back to Port Kemler and worked in the primary end of the, of the works running the blast furnaces and co ovens and center plant. And I used to complain about the quality of the iron. All we were getting from, from Mount Newman, it was called in, in Western Australia. So they said, well, would you like to go and run the mine and fix it? So I spent four or five years in the pilborough running, running a mine at the time. But it was pretty rough there. It was fairly early in the ages and the place used to go on strike every second week. And Wow. It was a a, it was sort of a bracing experience for someone who'd thought they were an engineer. They weren't meant to be an industrial relations specialist.
Speaker 2 00:07:15 So you had to learn these other skills as it were on the job You
Speaker 3 00:07:18 Did. Yeah. Yeah. School of hard knocks in some cases, but we got there and eventually pilborough quietened down and these days you don't hear anything about it. So it's, there was, I sort of see that I was one of the, the stepping stones in just changing the culture a little bit.
Speaker 2 00:07:39 Really important to, to lead that way. Now, approximately how old were you when you went?
Speaker 3 00:07:44 That would've, I would've been late thirties, I guess.
Speaker 2 00:07:46 In thirties. And did you go with your then family?
Speaker 3 00:07:49 Yes, yes. The kids were primary school age. It's the best school they ever went to because we owned it, the company owned it. And so unlike all the states run, the schools pretty run down the company. Schools were all air conditioned and well equipped and so on. And it was a funny rule in Western Australia that anyone who, any young teacher coming out of university would get two years seniority for every year they spent north of the Tropic of Capricorn. Ah, and Newman was about 20 kilometers north of the Tropic of Capricorn. So we got the pick of the teachers. They were terrific. Mm. The kids were very reluctant to, to leave that. And when we went to Port Headland, they went to boarding school in Perth. So it was, yeah, it was character building for them too, I think.
Speaker 2 00:08:37 And look, the Pilbara has always been a fascinating area and really important friend history and, you know, indigenous relations, for example. Did you have many First Nations staff at that stage?
Speaker 3 00:08:48 No, we, we, we had a, a handful of them, but not too many. The, the, because it was a closed town, at least when I went there, I eventually sold it to the Shire for a dollar. Wow. But, and they were rewarded us by quadrupling our rates. But when the town opened up, the people from Jilong, which was the, the closest settlement started to percolate into town. I set up a, an aboriginal apprenticeship scheme there, but it didn't really work too well. A big problem was these kids would go for the town and then go home with their PA packet and Mm mm and all the relatives would want a, a bit of the pay packet. So the kids were getting virtually nothing for the effort they were putting in.
Speaker 2 00:09:39 Yeah. A lot of sharing going on. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:09:41 That's which is a, a laudable trait. But on the other hand, for a, for a 17-year-old kid who's sweated his guts out Yeah. As a fitter or something, he was not particularly rewarding. So, mm. Eventually we turned it around a little bit. And after I left, I think when the town opened up and they didn't have to commute out to the, the settlements, the was a bit more of a, an effort that was, was worthwhile. And I understand that these days the workforce is between five and 10% aboriginal.
Speaker 2 00:10:19 Yeah. It's really kicked on a lot. I think
Speaker 3 00:10:20 It has. Yeah. It was difficult and, you know, dealing with people who'd never really lived around heavy machinery and those sorts of things. So Yeah. It, you had to be careful and things like safety were a strange, strange concept that you had to imbue in people.
Speaker 2 00:10:38 So, and look, the distance is incredible. I'll just say, say one more thing about the mining industry. I remember when I first came here, they had a series of stamps and they're all mines. Yeah. You know, Mount Newman was one of them. I remember very clearly sending this back to Canada and I said, I think it was one of the few countries where they had four mines on the postage stamps because they were so significant to the economy. Oh, that's
Speaker 3 00:10:56 Right. You know,
Speaker 2 00:10:57 They still are really, are really, if if anything more so now you'd, if you had stamps Yeah. You'd cover the whole envelope with them.
Speaker 3 00:11:04 And I'm pretty annoyed that when I was there, they sold iron or for 15 bucks a ton. That's now over a hundred. So it's,
Speaker 2 00:11:10 The world has Yeah. Really altered. Has Alton. So then what brought you back to Melbourne then?
Speaker 3 00:11:16 Well, that stage, the steel industry was getting into trouble and Malcolm Fraser, who was a prime minister, sort of said, go and wear a, a hair shirt and suck in, suck it in. Bob Hook got elected on the basis of fixing the steel industry in a hundred days. So I was called back to actually head the negotiations with the government about the future of the steel industry. Wow. Ended up spending, I think it was 23 days in the box at the, there was a New South Wales government inquiry. I sat in the witness box explaining the steel industry for 23 days. That was quite, quite an interesting experience.
Speaker 2 00:12:04 So was this 1983?
Speaker 3 00:12:06 This 83 84
Speaker 2 00:12:07 M So when Hot came
Speaker 3 00:12:09 And then, and then after, after the devaluation of the Australian, the, the floating of the Australian dollar, the problem went away. So we had pretty rough time for a little while, but it was a, it was a good time from the viewpoint that I met some, you know, the Bill Kelty and Harry s and Yeah. These sorts of characters who, you know, they genuinely wanted to solve the problem too. So we, yep. The industrial side was again, something that became have bearing. Then after that I moved into running the shipping business and then running the research laboratories and the future planning episode and ended up running all our external relations. So
Speaker 2 00:12:57 It's, you're very modest about this. I gotta say it's pretty fantastic because a lot of things that occurred, you know, floating the dollar, changing the way that the exchange rates worked and tariffs and so on, hugely important for transforming the Australian economy. You were right in the center stage.
Speaker 3 00:13:10 That's right. I was lucky to be there at the time. And that I learned a lot about it. It was a quite a challenging period. It was very long hours and so on. But as I say, we ended up in a situation that we were pretty satisfied with the result.
Speaker 2 00:13:27 Wow. Well talk about productivity. They say that some of the most important productivity gains in Australian history post World War ii. Yeah. In that, in that decade you were, you know, right, right at the riverside for that. And then of course, education. It sounds like this theme has always been there. You know, if you started off with science, then you did your degree, but you're always been aware of skills and always aware of the importance. I guess those discussions with Bill Kelty, et cetera, would've really reinforced those as well.
Speaker 3 00:13:50 Yeah. And Laurie Carmichael was a sort of very instrumental in telling me what, how the world should work. Right. But no, I, I'd been interested in education. I, I, I guess I, when I came back to Melbourne, an old professor from Melbourne invited me to join the faculty at the engineering school in, at Melbourne University. And I began to see that things needed to be fixed in education. At the same time. When I took over running research in BHP, I realized that the re relationships between companies and the universities left a hell, hell of a lot to be desired. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:14:38 The mutual misunderstanding on both sides. Mm. The, the academics often thought that company money was tainted and we'd be far better to get a, a, a research grant from the a RC or something. And the company side said, I can't understand what the academics are talking about. So I, I, that's how I got more involved in education. I wrote a, I gave a speech at a, I've forgotten what organization was now I know it was up in Threadbow or somewhere. Okay. And somehow John Dawkins was given a copy of it. And because of this emphasis of getting companies and educated us to work more closely, he said he, it's this new board called the National Board for Employment Education and Training was just being formed. Right. And he needed a neutral sort of chair, not someone from the, 'cause the NV head schools, universities, a RC, higher education and International education. So there's five committees reported to it. And the, they, they needed a neutral chair. So they were terrific meetings. Laurie Carmichael looked after the, the technical side and Chubb was the head of higher education. Max Brennan, Rodney, the a RC. Wow. Top people. They were, yeah. They were enjoyable meeting, I dunno where we achieved anything, but we all had enjoyed the meetings anyway.
Speaker 2 00:16:07 I reckon you, you did achieve it. It would've been, what, 87 or something like that?
Speaker 3 00:16:11 Or it's Yeah, it was, it was after the, the Dawkins reforms. Oh. After,
Speaker 2 00:16:17 So a
Speaker 3 00:16:17 Bit later then it was when Hex Hex was brought in. We had a fair bit to do with that. Okay. And it, I began to understand the system a little bit better. And it was because of that, I guess then Vice Chancellor here invited me to become Chancellor.
Speaker 2 00:16:38 So let me ask you this. When did you first, because you mentioned Melbourne a lot. Yeah. When did you first really become aware of Victoria University or, or FIT or its predecessors?
Speaker 3 00:16:48 Well, I've been vaguely aware of FITI, I first became interested in Victoria University because my then boss in BHP was a fellow called Russell Finmore, who was on the initial council when Creighton Burns was the first chancellor. Right. And Russell used to talk, talk quite regularly about Victoria University. It wedded my interest in, because I've always thought that there is a, even though it was not always acknowledged by everyone, there was a pecking order in universities. Yeah. And there was a niche that each of them should fit in. And I saw the opportunity with the Victoria University to better define that niche and to try and work out how you're going to benefit from it. It was, I must admit that there was a, a range of disagreements between the senior management at Victoria University of as far as direction was concerned. But, and because it was a dual sector university, there was a sort of a internal ructions going on in terms of Yeah. What the balance should be on various things. I guess my time at, at as chancellor that bridging the gap between higher education and technical education was one of the things was the time we took over Western Institute. Right. We, we only just merged as a university, so we were still absorbing the, the merger for with foot, foot Gray. And then we took over Western and I think that we went from I think four campuses to 10 mm If I
Speaker 2 00:18:47 Remember rightly, it grew up incredibly
Speaker 3 00:18:49 Fast. Yeah. And that we had some growing pains. Then there was a, there was a fair bit of dissension on the campus.
Speaker 2 00:18:54 Did you ever say no to a campus?
Speaker 3 00:18:59 We, we, no, we never said, we never said no as such. We were aware, for instance, at that stage, there were one or two campuses that were costing us money and would've recommended that they close down. But it was places like we, we had a campus at Melton, for instance, that clearly was never going to be worthwhile. It might be if you open it today, but in those days it was a, it was a sort of a cup lunch. Oh. It was pretty strong day trip out to see her. Yeah. And, but the politics of it was such that. Right. And we worked very closely with the state government had in Story and Phil Honeywood. Right. They, you know, I'd broached these subjects with 'em, but they sort of said
Speaker 2 00:19:47 Maybe, maybe not. So let me just for the sake of the listeners, 'cause there's history here, which we're skating over that you were chancellor for five years from 1995 to 2000. And it was still VUT at that time. Yes. Okay. Victoria University of Technology with a very strong focus on engineering and business.
Speaker 3 00:20:06 Well, it was never as strong as it sounded on Okay. On the, on engineering, the engineering faculty was fairly small. Yeah. And it wasn't particularly highly regarded by the profession, I guess. So it became as no surprise that in fact they, it was sort of wound back. Right. In those days, certainly business and arts and the, and some of the sports science things were started off very well. We always learned, learn how bad my golf drive was down in the basement at 300 Flinder Street. So Yeah. It was interesting times then. But we were struggling to, for our identity, yes. We weren't quite sure what we wanted to be. Yep. And there wasn't universal agreement amongst the cha the vice chancellors and the, and the deans and the deputy vice chancellors. It's a
Speaker 2 00:21:07 Hard thing to decide. Right. I mean, you know, it's Yeah. Those positioning. So the history that I've looked at, well, as you say, there's debates, but there's also reaction to international forces happening and the burgeoning places like Monash, you know, ever bigger and really growing Yeah. A period of sort of fallow time at Latrobe, you know, went through a long period of not That's right. Not doing as much. And then the new, you know, newish kids on the RMIT, of course is older, but it grew a lot Yeah. As well. So it's kind of what was the special role other than its geography and its geography was pretty profound.
Speaker 3 00:21:41 Well, that's what I've, I always tried to convince people that we should regard Victoria University as a, a regional university in a, in a capital city. We've got a region and we should work with the locals in the same way as in Ballarat or Wagga or Lismore or all these sort of places where there is a regional university to identify the businesses that you work with the school, get to know the locals if you like, and, and sort of treat yourself as you as if you were a regional university. Not overdo it. And, and try and pick up the advantages of some kids will still want to travel across town to go to university, but Yeah. To, to try and at least foster that relationships rather than to try and pretend you are a, a Melbourne University in exile, if you like.
Speaker 2 00:22:34 Yeah. We don't wanna do that. No. Try. Now listen, one of the things that's very interesting, you were actually chancellor at the time when the first bachelor of Paramedicine was introduced.
Speaker 3 00:22:44 I believe so, yeah.
Speaker 2 00:22:45 And how does it feel now? We have the largest program anywhere and we'll have a center of excellence nationally that we're opening next year. You were there at the first step?
Speaker 3 00:22:54 Yes. It's, it wasn't top of mind. I'd have to say I was aware of it, but I can remember more arguments about osteopathy and these things than paramedicine. But it was, when we were looking for the niches we were gonna fit in sports science and health sciences and so on seemed to be an obvious one. Not, not putting up a med school, although there was some people that wanted a med school. Right. I, as an engineer, I even opposed, I was lukewarm about a law school, I must admit. Right. I often say I spent half my career fighting accountant, first half of the career fighting accountants and second half fighting lawyers. So I didn't want to see them proliferate more, but I lost that argument, which would probably just as well. But I certainly was very strongly supportive of the idea of, of these para sciences sitting around the medical. So because they were neglected and yet they're the, the frontline of, of, of, of emergency medicine or all, all medicine in some respects. Mm. Nursing plus the paramedical type people. So it, I I was very glad to see that the roots we planted back then have actually grown and flourished to the center that to the extent of now, now leaders in the country.
Speaker 2 00:24:20 That's right. It's fantastic. Well, it's like you'd planted the tree and it's quite tall now, you know?
Speaker 3 00:24:24 Really? Yeah. I would love to be able to put my hand on my heart and say that I had a, a lot to do with it, but I, I strongly supported it. But there were some pretty energetic people working on it at that stage.
Speaker 2 00:24:37 But again, you trademark modesty shines through Peter because it's a bit like the national Board of Education and training. These are important moments. Oh
Speaker 3 00:24:45 Yeah. Things change.
Speaker 2 00:24:45 Things change. Things change and skills you see so fascinating at tafe and we've really come to the fore now realizing that paramedicine or its precursors, non-emergency, non-emergency patient transport and, and others are just as important. Yeah. From the point of view of the department now it's all one thing. So really that kind of vision you had of skills based, you know, bringing together TAFE in higher ed. Perfect. Yeah. Really perfect example.
Speaker 3 00:25:10 We've still got, we still haven't gone as far as we'd like, I'd, I really like to see joint research programs between higher education and tafe. Yep. A few of those types of things where you get out of the clouds and you get down to solving real life problems. Yep. And where TAFE can, can be in a situation that they've got people working with them that they can identify, you know, this is, this is possible, this is too difficult. That sort of thing. Which the academic side of it probably wouldn't understand,
Speaker 2 00:25:46 But you talked before about people's well parody of esteem or That's right. Reputation. There's been a long time where that's been coming. But actually universities have always had that issue with research and teaching as well. Yeah. Or with professional staff and academic staff. Now I think this place, this one vu approach is putting that parity of steam really strongly out there. And I think it's
Speaker 3 00:26:08 Not before time, I think. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:26:09 Not before time. I agree with you. It's really true. Now, of course, you've been recognized for lots of things aside from an honorary doctorate here. We'll talk about that in a minute. But can I just ask you about your member of the Order of Australia, because that was service not just to industry, but to tertiary education. Do you remember that whole event? And were you surprised at the time?
Speaker 3 00:26:27 I was surprised at the time. I've got no idea who nominated me. Right. And the citation was a little bit odd. I must admit. They, they seemed to put a lot of emphasis on some things and seemed to ignore other things. But I I, I sort of took it as said. Thank you. But I haven't, I think I've got my badge on today, but I, I don't normally bother too much about it.
Speaker 2 00:26:57 No. Well, I do appreciate you wearing it to today's discussion. 'cause you know, it's a bit of a focal point, but also some of the changes you've seen, we spoke about this, you know, about six months ago too. Skills were in the offing. Yeah. And now they're absolutely essential. And even post-degree skills. So in other words, not just before, but after. Right.
Speaker 3 00:27:17 But I always thought that there's a room for TAFE as a postgraduate course. Mm. That you get the basics in your, your undergraduate course, and then you actually learn how to employ them through a TAFE course. But it's never, it's, it's been there a long time and I don't think the problem's gone away. There. There's a community problem, there's parents' problems, there's perceptions. And I, I'd have to say there's an academic problem too, that there's a, certainly TAFE teachers, were not necessarily envied by higher education academics. Hmm.
Speaker 2 00:28:05 Well, we tried to get rid of the envy. Yeah. Or lack thereof. And have disrespect. Yeah. So, you know, now the same superannuation wages are very similar. Portability starting to be talked about, you know, teaching back a four and forth and fascinatingly there's programs like early childhood where both can play together really strongly. Yeah. You know, so it's
Speaker 3 00:28:26 Good. And, and that's what, you know, joint research programs, joint institutes and various other things where you've got components at that sort of level rather than separate buildings and so on, seem to me to be a, a step in the, in the, in the right direction. But it's, it also overcomes another fetish that I've had for many years about how much of our higher education system is wasted by the way, in which people take on courses on the basis of their, their atar rather than on what their true vocational interests are and so on. They don't understand that just because you're not wasting it if you're, if you've got 10 more points than you, you need to, to get in. Yeah. What you should be starting with is what your personal interests and strengths are and build on those in the studies you do. Yeah. It'll mean the dropout ratio rates will, will fall. Mm. If you've got a safety net in, in, in either way, a safety net in higher education for people leaving TAFE or who can't hack the tools and so on or the other way around of people who can't quite keep up with the academic work, being able to move back to TAFE seamlessly. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:29:51 I think that's so important.
Speaker 3 00:29:52 And it'll, it'll pay for itself because we're wasting a hell of a lot of taxpayers money now educating people to for two years and then they disappear. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:30:03 Let's, let's avoid that.
Speaker 3 00:30:04 So it's, I think the, the block arrangements that you've got will help a great deal in that sort of thing. They'll go with some, some, some marketable skills when if they leave early
Speaker 2 00:30:17 And, and Peter, it's fascinating. You're, you're so perceptive because we've started offering up to three or four programs at once. Yeah. A degree and a diploma. Sometimes it's a certificate, so people can choose between different levels up to them. Yeah. Before we, in the olden days, you had to apply for one say yes or no, withdraw and reapply again. How silly.
Speaker 3 00:30:38 Well, it's a different, you know, one was feds and one was saved. You know, there's a whole, a whole lot of things that in there that are, are making the system inefficient. So it's, yeah.
Speaker 2 00:30:49 It's come a long way, but, you know, a long way to go now then back to your honorary doctorate here, and we're delighted it's to 10 years ago, of course this happened. It's almost like a, it's gone like lightning. Do you remember the moment?
Speaker 3 00:31:00 I do. It was out at Flemington Race course, I think. Yes. And when I jogged my memory, when you had talked about coming here today, I went trolled through the back of my computer and even found the speech that I'd given to it.
Speaker 2 00:31:16 Wow. You've got a good system.
Speaker 3 00:31:19 No, it's, it's completely random, but just, just an accident. I found it. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:31:24 That's great. Do you remember what your themes were?
Speaker 3 00:31:27 Just that universities are a three-legged institutions. They have a, an education site, a research site, and a community engagement site. And too many of the university are, are probably too, too much concentrated on the research. Then the education and the community engagement is third. And one of the things that I admired about Victoria University was that they did spend a lot of time on community engagement type things. Not as much as I would've liked, particularly with business, but they, in terms of interfaces with community organizations and so on, they probably did better than the other, other, other larger more prestigious institutions. So I just congratulated the, the then chancellor and vice chancellor on Right. Being able to foster this three-legged stool. Oh, that's great. Top approach. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:32:27 It's a good image. And you know, we had very interesting week and day last week where I think it was about 440 volunteers from our own cohort as well as all of our partners, industry partners we're planting 5,000 trees in a day in one day in Werribee. Talk about community impact and, and there were little kindergarten children there helping, you know, sort of assisting us more than you could possibly imagine. It sounds great. Really good. So, you know, it's the, that kind of place, it's got a real heart for community impact. We'll
Speaker 3 00:32:57 Make the werribee was a bit of a windswept plane too, so it'll be beneficial from that
Speaker 2 00:33:02 Viewpoint. Imagine Werribee Forest Park in the future. That's right. Exactly. That's gonna be a good thing to imagine. So now you've continued to support us. Thank you so much. Through philanthropy, including here at vu. What does motivate you to give back that could maybe inspire others?
Speaker 3 00:33:20 Well, first thing, I I can, I can afford to do it. Right.
Speaker 3 00:33:26 One of the things of walking, working for BHP for 40 years, you accumulate quite a few shares and they've been very generous in their dividend policy. So, so that's part of it. I've, my kids have adequately provided for, I can't take it with me, so, right. But I, I have a policy, I used to run the Philanthr philanthropy part of BHP. Right. And also back in the Brex and Brumby government, I chaired a body called the Community Advisory Council, which handed out the money from the hotel poker machines, which to worthy causes. So I've got to understand philanthropy reasonably well. And so I've got a system now it's, I have a budget, split it three ways. Yeah. A third for education, a type things, a third for welfare and a third for the arts. Great. Now the, the education, I, I suppose there's two or three different organizations that I support there. There's about three or three or four. And, and I'm pretty heavily involved in places like Victorian Opera and so and so.
Speaker 2 00:34:50 Oh, that's so
Speaker 3 00:34:51 Good. So it, it, it's, it's, as a retired person with minimal external essential external engagements, it's, it's not bad to, to get involved in those things. In fact, later this afternoon I'm going to, to a Melbourne Trust rehearsal where the, an eminent conductor is teaching the scholars in the MEbA program how to perform in, in a CHO group. Wow. These workshops, I find there's a lot more in musical production than I thought there was.
Speaker 2 00:35:31 There seems to be know we at least have a musical program here too. But to sincerely, when you think about it from a, the one of the earliest mine managers in the history of the company, and by the way we're talking about Broken Hill Proprietary. Yeah. Limited, interesting name wasn't it at the time. Yeah, that's right. Right through to your role as chancellor right. Through to today and next year, our hundred and 10th birthday. We couldn't be more delighted and we just so wanted to salute your generosity, but also your forward thinking. 'cause a lot of the innovations, not just paramedicine, a lot of the others were ahead of their time. Yeah. And that's what you're doing as a giving person too. And I wanna thank you for it.
Speaker 3 00:36:06 Yeah. I'm only too happy. It gives me a great deal of satisfaction to, to see some outcomes from these
Speaker 2 00:36:12 Things. And would you see the look on the faces of the students who you're supporting, you know, and they, that's, that's what the real payoff for us is, is seeing the impact.
Speaker 3 00:36:19 And I'd have to say your frontline people who interface with donors and so on are pretty good. Pretty persistent
Speaker 2 00:36:29 In a good way that That's right.
Speaker 3 00:36:31 But it's a good experience. There's some people that I've supported over the years that I just wonder whether they, they really deserve that, that sort of interest in them because they seem to be happy to take the money and then you don't hear of 'em anything about them for years, for a year or two.
Speaker 2 00:36:51 So. Well I know you like threes because you talk about three stools or three That's right. Legs on the stool and three different brackets for giving. Yeah. Our motto with three is follow through. Follow through, follow through. That's right. Yeah. You know, and that's another example of it. Yeah. So, Peter, we can't wait to invite you back. We're having this hundred 10th anniversary next year. I hope you'll agree and you know, bring some of your family if you'd like. I hope that you enjoy today as much as we have. It's been fantastic. Thank you very,
Speaker 3 00:37:17 I'm glad to have been, had the opportunity. Thanks.
Speaker 2 00:37:21 That's great.
